fiestaturbo.com

by **Stoned** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:23 pm

http://www.ukfiestanetwork.co.uk/forum//index.php?s=6e2de58106061960992fb0d042ebcc8d&act=ST&f=2&t=10939&st=60

Amusing thread with our very own Ade laying the smack down on some dude at UKFiestaNetwork.

They both are adamant they are right and are prepared to lay down money to back up their claims!

go ade, go ade, go! :lol:

p.s. dont go over there and cause trouble, just worth monitoring to see who prevails

by **AdrianFRST** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:25 pm

I don't normally get involved in that sort of thing, but when someone is so blatantly wrong it's hard to resist!

by **Stoned** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:26 pm

Well respect to you dude. I have no idea who is right, but I would trust yours and Sunny's opinion before his lol :lol:

by **Graceland** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:34 pm

lmfao - love it!!!!

it's a bit like the arguement i had with a ford bloke about the sierra DOHC and the Mk5 escort rs2000 engine - the block IS the same. lmfao - ford technical bloke said it was impossible that i had an rs2000 engine in my sierra - he was willing to lay down money aswell - he went off sulking when i lifted my bonnet and showed him that i do indeedy have an rs2000 engine

anyways - back to subject - ade is right. easy peasy

by **AdrianFRST** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:35 pm

For those that aren't aware:

The Focus RS engine is basically a series 3 (black top) Zetec with stronger internals and a few other bits to cope with turbocharging, like the sodium filled exhaust valves.

In their infinate wisdom, Ford decided to brand the engine "Duratec RS" despite it not actually being a Duratec (presumably as the "Zetec" name is over 10 years old and Ford want to move on, esp with such a major car.

A "proper" Duratec has an aluminum block, compared to the Zetec's cast iron, and the head is "reversed" - the inlet manifold is on the front and the exhaust manifold is on the back. They are totally different, about the only thing he got right.

What gets me is he says "The Rs engine bears no rezembalance to a zetec engine whatsoever there COMPLETELY different" then later agrees that the bore and stroke are identical, as are the cam cover.

The trouble is all the Ford literature says "Duratec" so inexperinced people like this take that as gospel and don't recognise the underlying components.

by **AdrianFRST** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:37 pm

Series 3 Zetec

Focus RS engine:

Duratec engine:

The series 3 is an early one, the very latest s3 Zetecs have a plastic cam cover with the same oil filler cap as the FRS and the same plastic injector loom cover.

by **XR2i Chick** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:37 pm

Interesting Reading! I think I learnt Somthing!

Its getting as good as the Sunny vs Mike Post last week!!!!

by **MENTAL** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:39 pm

So in other words he is just an argumentative tw@t :lol:

Sunny - Mike post i missed that anyone got the link ???

by **XR2i Chick** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:45 pm

http://www.fiestaturbo.com/phpBB/viewto ... sc&start=0

Its a Long one!!

by **MENTAL** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:48 pm

thanx

by **Oxide** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 10:55 pm

AdrianFRST :For those that aren't aware:

A "proper" Duratec has an aluminum block, compared to the Zetec's cast iron, and the head is "reversed" - the inlet manifold is on the front and the exhaust manifold is on the back. They are totally different, about the only thing he got right.

Hello again nice to see people find a constructive conversation between myself and ade so amusing, if i knew you'd find it this entertaining myself and ade could of charged people and making mintloads

Anyway not all zetec blocks are cast iron. The 1.6 zetec s block is pure aluminium

by **AdrianFRST** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:00 pm

That's a Zetec-SE it's different.

Zetec-S is the name of the car, not the engine.

The larger Zetecs - 1.8 and 2.0 / FRS and the older 1.6 (as in the Si) are all cast iron.

by **Excursion** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:10 pm

Oxide :
AdrianFRST :For those that aren't aware:

A "proper" Duratec has an aluminum block, compared to the Zetec's cast iron, and the head is "reversed" - the inlet manifold is on the front and the exhaust manifold is on the back. They are totally different, about the only thing he got right.

Hello again nice to see people find a constructive conversation between myself and ade so amusing, if i knew you'd find it this entertaining myself and ade could of charged people and making mintloads

Anyway not all zetec blocks are cast iron. The 1.6 zetec s block is pure aluminium

The zetec-SE (signma) yeah, but were talking the big zetecs - 1.6-2.0

by **Gaz7** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:28 pm

Adrian is right.

At work, the engine is called a 2.0L 200PS Zetec.

The engine is basically a reworked zetec - there are differences but the basic principles are the same.

The Duratec badge is partly to set the engine apart (it is after all not identical to a 2.0L NA zetec), but mostly because of this :

At work we call all the engines by their correct names so there is no confusion. However current policy sees new petrol engines called Duratec to the public (Durable Technology) and new diesel engines called Duratorq (a play on the above taking the quite massive torque figures our new diesels produce.)

A Focus RS engine is not simply a 2.0L Zetec with a turbo strapped on, there are many differences. The basic engine architecture however, is the same.

I can't reply on the other forums as i'm not registered, but someone could cut and paste if they like :bonkers:

Gareth

Green team leader, Prototype Vehicle Operations, DEPO, Dunton

by **Tom Kirkland** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:29 pm

Thats was a good post :lol:

by **snake** on Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:35 pm

lmfao

didn`t see the post but ukfn asways amuses me and my posts get deleted lolol! wonder why :rolleyes:

by **Stoned** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 8:09 am

Aww they deleted the post

However you cant keep the people down for long and a substitute one has appeared in it's place

http://www.ukfiestanetwork.co.uk/forum//index.php?s=5f34c37f61b1db04e3aacb503b160fc5&act=ST&f=2&t=11056&st=0&#entry177856

by TJ on Tue Sep 30, 2003 8:57 am

I know crap all about engines, but every report ive read says its a duratec engine, so i can see how the uneducated can mistake it for a duratec block.

At the end of the day, i'll take info frmo anywhere, so no matter what discussion goes on regarding this i'll read it all, and take it in!

*Hmm where the hell was i going then*

Need input!

by **Sphinx** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:13 am

@ TJ, those r gr8 films! :bonkers:

by **SimonT** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 9:15 am

its the same thing that happened in the early 90's with F1.

Ford basically said to cosworth that "if we give you a few quid can you call you engines Zetecs and not cosworths" hence promoting the zetec name.

10 years on and there doing it with the Duratec with the Focus RS

cheers

ST

by **PhilM** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:18 pm

Ive dont absolutely FUCKLOADS of reserach on Zetecs and Duratec HEs. (STraight 4s).

And as Ade and Gaz have said, 100% FACT: The Focus RS engine is a development of the Series3 zetec, same block, head etc, just reworked internals, minor differances). *ye, i nkow bnlock etc has a turbo oil reurtn, blah blah, essentially the same engine tho.

The 2.0 Duratec HE as per the new mondeos is a TOTALLY DIFFERENT ENGINE, all ally and fudgekin ace (better than the s3 zetec!).

Gaz, i didnt think it was a dveleopment of the Zetec S3 at all? Thaught it was a development of an original idea for a Turbo'd Straight 4 Forumla One engine cosworth did back in the day

. Either way, VERY good engine and definatly NOTHING to do with zetec S3 or focus RS engine

.

Duratec is simply a name they put on the Focus engine for marketing etc to promote the "Dura..." family of engines for is now using.

Gaz mate, answer me a question. Zetec E and Zetec R, rod lengths, is it true that the Zetec R (series 3) has a 5mm longer rod than that of the earlier zetec 2 (series 2) engines?

Cheers

by **snake** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 7:05 pm

Gaz mate, answer me a question. Zetec E and Zetec R, rod lengths, is it true that the Zetec R (series 3) has a 5mm longer rod than that of the earlier zetec 2 (series 2) engines?

not certain but believe they are diff length as deck heights on aftermarket pistons differs between silver and black tops

by **Gaz7** on Tue Sep 30, 2003 11:44 pm

As philM has said, the Duratec HE's are different again, although they bear the same badge.

"Gaz, i didnt think it was a dveleopment of the Zetec S3 at all? Thaught it was a development of an original idea for a Turbo'd Straight 4 Forumla One engine cosworth did back in the day . Either way, VERY good engine and definatly NOTHING to do with zetec S3 or focus RS engine . ""

Not sure what you mean by that mate, what didn't you think was a development of the zetec?

As for the rod lengths i'm not certain off the top of my head, as the silver top zetecs were developed before my time, i'd have still worked at Dagenham then as that was quite a few years ago now, although i could find out.... As far as i believe though there are differences, although i couldn't say if it was exactly 5mm or not.

And as for confusion, we've been developing various new zetecs of different origins at work, and there's a chance they'll all be released bearing the Duratec badge..... and that will confuse things as they're all pretty different :lol:

Gareth

by **SimonT** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 2:46 pm

just to add a small point:

All F1 engines with turbo's where only 1.5litres - regardless of being a straight 4 or v6.

Ford never made a Inline 4 F1 turbo engine - Only the V6 (Built by cosworth)

There is a very small chance that the inline 4cylinder turbo engine built by brian hart may of started its life as a ford unit but unfortunatly i dont have enough info to confirm this

cheers

st

by **Gaz7** on Thu Oct 02, 2003 6:10 pm

Phil, were you refering to the Duratec-HE when you said : "Gaz, i didnt think it was a dveleopment of the Zetec S3 at all? Thaught it was a development of an original idea for a Turbo'd Straight 4 Forumla One engine cosworth did back in the day . Either way, VERY good engine and definatly NOTHING to do with zetec S3 or focus RS engine . "

If so i don't know who told you that as it's not correct. I assume you're talking about the all ally chain driven Duratec-HE?

This started life in America, where it was initially designed and developed, and used in American Rangers.

Development then switched to my department where we devised a different head for it and other refinements.

Further revisions are currently being undertaken so the engine can be used in other applications, in fact i've been working on it for the past week. Although different from the Zetec, all ally, American developed etc, it's still from the same generic family. All the zetec special tools fit the Duratec-HE for example.

It is an excellent engine, and the current revisions we're making make it even better still.

Gareth

by **PhilM** on Thu Oct 02, 2003 9:22 pm

yep..i was refering to the duratec he all ally enigne.

Sound! learn something new every day...actually got that bit of info from a Ford press release if i remember rightly.

I love the Duratec 2.0 HE, ace engine, absolutely awesome, very nice head, very nice bore and stroke, lovely, would absolutely cane the Zetec and Cosworth engines IMO if it had a set of steel rods, forged pistons and was turbo'd.

Extremely nice engine, you got any ex-development engines going spare/cheap? ones that would have gone in the skip?

by **Gaz7** on Fri Oct 03, 2003 1:26 pm

Lol, that press release was way off if that's what it told you!

You're right, it is a really good engine, soon to be used a lot more. We've got loads and loads that go in the skip, but unfortunately they're a little bit big to get past security!!! - it seems a waste they just get scrapped ( some have often only been started once or not at all!) but that's the way it's always been.

If you like the engine at the moment, you'll love the developed ones that we've done that'll be coming out :wink:

Gareth

by **PhilM** on Fri Oct 03, 2003 5:44 pm

I know people who have done a few development ideas on them

Standard untouched enigne with tubular exh manifold, 45 throttle bodies and a live map.....dynod at 270bhp normally aspirated.

fudgekin awesome engines....would love to do one oneday, but at the moment with them being new, theres a lack of forged pistons/steel rods etc on the market.

by **Gaz7** on Fri Oct 03, 2003 6:13 pm

Yeah, i mean evolutionary developments tho rather than mods, fairly big stuff, there's a really good one being prepared for one of Ford's companies, really good stuff

All of our stuff is made in house, being prototype, so we don't have any probs getting what we want lol

Gareth

by **Excursion** on Fri Oct 03, 2003 6:44 pm

PhilM :I know people who have done a few development ideas on them

Standard untouched enigne with tubular exh manifold, 45 throttle bodies and a live map.....dynod at 270bhp normally aspirated.

dickens awesome engines....would love to do one oneday, but at the moment with them being new, theres a lack of forged pistons/steel rods etc on the market.

That's what's going in my Fiesta in the new year Phil - had originally started looking at the engines earlier this year but got the A4 instead. Once I've saved up i'll get started. I used to read duratecperformance a bit, the forums on there. I will be using JE pistons, they can make any spec up you want. Looking for 400 myself, but unsure about the liners? Does anybody know the limits yet or am I going to have to suck it and see?

fiestaturbo.com

Focus RS Zetec or Duratec? - Fight!

Focus RS Zetec or Duratec? - Fight!